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	<title>Awkward Loop - Vivek Sanghi&#039;s Web Diary &#187; Mythology</title>
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	<description>A weblog of Vivek&#039;s views, observations, book reviews and some brain fart :)</description>
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		<title>Karna&#8217;s Curse -The one I didn&#8217;t know about</title>
		<link>http://www.diary.viveksanghi.com/2011/02/karnas-curse-the-one-i-didnt-know-about/</link>
		<comments>http://www.diary.viveksanghi.com/2011/02/karnas-curse-the-one-i-didnt-know-about/#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Mon, 07 Feb 2011 18:03:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Vivek</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[India]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Indian Mythology]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Mythology]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[karna]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[mahabharata]]></category>

		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.diary.viveksanghi.com/?p=403</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Tweet Well I didn&#8217;t know about this one. A very impressive story. (source: Wikipedia) Andhra folklore states that once Karna while riding his chariot in his kingdom of Anga, encountered a child who was crying over her pot of spilt ghee. On asking her the reason for her dismay, she stated that she feared her [...]]]></description>
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			<div style="float:left; width:85px;padding-right:10px; margin:4px 4px 4px 4px;height:30px;"><script src="http://www.stumbleupon.com/hostedbadge.php?s=1&amp;r=http://www.diary.viveksanghi.com/2011/02/karnas-curse-the-one-i-didnt-know-about/"></script></div>			
			</div><div style="clear:both"></div><div style="padding-bottom:4px;"></div><p>Well I didn&#8217;t know about this one. A very impressive story.</p>
<p>(source: Wikipedia)<br />
Andhra folklore states that once Karna while riding his chariot in his kingdom of Anga, encountered a child who was crying over her pot of spilt ghee. On asking her the reason for her dismay, she stated that she feared her step mother who would be angry over her carelessness. Being generous enough Karna told her that he would give her new ghee (clarified butter). But, the child insisted that she wanted only the ghee that was mixed with the soil and refused to take the new ghee. Taking pity on the girl, Karna took the soil mixed with ghee in his fist and squeezed it with all his might to extract the ghee and pour it back into the pot. During this process, Karna heard the agonized voice of a woman. When he opened his fist, he realized that the voice was that of Bhoomidevi &#8211; the Earth goddess. Furious, she chastised Karna for inflicting enormous pain on Mother Earth for the sake of a mere child. So, the Earth goddess cursed him that in a very crucial battle of his life, she would trap his chariot wheel in the same way that he held the fistful of soil, thereby making him vulnerable to his enemy.</p>
<p>Well this story clears my doubt about Karna&#8217;s strength. Karna was as strong as Bhima. For he was undefeated in mace battle with bhima in the battle of Kurukshetra. In addition, he was amongst the few men such as Bhim, Duryodhana, Dau (Krishna&#8217;s elder brother) and Bhishma who could have killed Keechaka (a mighty and powerful warrior who was killed by bhima during agyatvasa). His knowledge about this fact led the Kauravas and Karna to attack Matsyadesh where the Pandavas were spending the year of their agyatvas.</p>
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		<title>yada yada</title>
		<link>http://www.diary.viveksanghi.com/2010/12/yada-yada/</link>
		<comments>http://www.diary.viveksanghi.com/2010/12/yada-yada/#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Fri, 31 Dec 2010 11:30:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Vivek</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[India]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Mythology]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Quotes]]></category>

		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.diary.viveksanghi.com/?p=400</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Tweet Yea I want to put down these great lines from a great epic here in my diary today. Without these lines this diary would have remained incomplete because there exists no parallel to these lines. No one in this mortal world can say these lines for sure. BTW am I turning religious or something? [...]]]></description>
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			</div><div style="clear:both"></div><div style="padding-bottom:4px;"></div><p>Yea I want to put down these great lines from a great epic here in my diary today. Without these lines this diary would have remained incomplete because there exists no parallel to these lines. No one in this mortal world can say these lines for sure.</p>
<p>BTW am I turning religious or something? Consequent posts related to mythology put me in doubt as well. But on a careful analysis the following causes have made me revisit mythology again and again this year:</p>
<p style="text-align: left;">1. Realization of my own imperfections and mistakes as I turn entrepreneurial.<br />
2. My incomplete struggle against my mind’s need for instant gratification and my temper.<br />
3.  A mind severely upset by the recent series of corruption scandals that broke out this year (make me wonder what kind of a world will I have to survive in and what kind of people will I deal with in future and what deeds will I have to undertake to grow)<br />
4. A mind that has become intolerant and started magnifying incompetence and mistakes of others to an extreme<br />
5. A mind that has always wanted to know about our origins and about where we are headed</p>
<p style="text-align: center;">Chapter IV</p>
<p style="text-align: center;">text vii<br />
<em>yada yada hi dharmasya<br />
glanir bhavati bharata<br />
abhyuthanam adharmasya<br />
tadatmanam srijamy aham</em></p>
<p style="text-align: center;">text viii<br />
<em>paritranaya sadhunam<br />
vinasaya ca duskrtam<br />
dharma-samsthapanarthaya<br />
sambhavami yuge yuge</em></p>
<p>Whenever and wherever there is a decline in rule of law, O descendant of Bharata, and a predominant rise of lawlessness, at that time I descend Myself. In order to deliver the pious and to annihilate the miscreants, as well as to re-establish the principles of law, I advent Myself millennium after millennium</p>
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		<title>Thirst for knowing our past</title>
		<link>http://www.diary.viveksanghi.com/2010/11/thirst-for-knowing-our-past/</link>
		<comments>http://www.diary.viveksanghi.com/2010/11/thirst-for-knowing-our-past/#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Sun, 21 Nov 2010 18:04:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Vivek</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[History]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[India]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Indian History]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Mythology]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[World]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[mahabharata]]></category>

		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.diary.viveksanghi.com/?p=394</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Tweet Since class 8th when I first learnt about our ancient history in our ICSE text books, I have always wanted to learn about the complete history of India. We (with reference to the Hindu religious scriptures) have a very long and elaborately recorded &#8220;history&#8221; here in India, which, though broken (seems to have lost) [...]]]></description>
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			<div style="float:left; width:85px;padding-right:10px; margin:4px 4px 4px 4px;height:30px;"><script src="http://www.stumbleupon.com/hostedbadge.php?s=1&amp;r=http://www.diary.viveksanghi.com/2010/11/thirst-for-knowing-our-past/"></script></div>			
			</div><div style="clear:both"></div><div style="padding-bottom:4px;"></div><p>Since class 8th when I first learnt about our ancient history in our ICSE text books, I have always wanted to learn about the complete history of India. We (with reference to the Hindu religious scriptures) have a very long and elaborately recorded &#8220;history&#8221; here in India, which, though broken (seems to have lost) at many vital places, provides a great story (in journalistic sense of the word) to tell. However, we are yet to prove that this history existed.</p>
<p>In my free time my mind dwells into thoughts that try to connect our mythology with our history. The questions that linger on my mind are:</p>
<p>- Was the war of Kurukshetra (from the epic Maharabharata) for real?<br />
- Are the yugas as described by hindu scriptures for real?<br />
- How can a religious or mythological epic have such vivid and mathematical descriptions of the war, the numbers (of participants, the dead and warrior kill stats etc)? Doesn&#8217;t it seem unnatural?<br />
- Did people from ancient times really travelled to other planets (as mentioned in Mahabharata)<br />
- So did they know whether other planets had life?<br />
- What really was the power of the super weapon mentioned in these scriptures? Were they, in principle, similar to the ones nations use today?<br />
- What was the position of other regions around the world at the &#8220;time&#8221; of Mahabharata? Were there advanced civilizations living there just as in Bharata?<br />
- Was the mind of the person that wrote Bhagvada Gita really Human? It does not seem possible for a mortal to even imagine such discpline and knowledge, let alone putting it down so eloquently in verses</p>
<p>I feel sad that I am so tied up in my business ventures that I do not have the time to quench this innate thirst.</p>
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		<title>&#8220;The Last Question&#8221; and why I am so intrigued by it</title>
		<link>http://www.diary.viveksanghi.com/2009/01/the-last-question-isaac-asimov/</link>
		<comments>http://www.diary.viveksanghi.com/2009/01/the-last-question-isaac-asimov/#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Fri, 30 Jan 2009 14:44:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Vivek</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Diary]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Fiction]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Indian Mythology]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Science Fiction]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Issac Asimov]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[science fiction]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[short-story]]></category>

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		<description><![CDATA[Tweet Hi, Yesterday I wanted to read this amazing short story by Isaac Asimov that I had read long ago during my MBA course. I did not know the title of the story and only remembered that it ended with the following line: &#8220;Let there be light&#8221;. So I googled &#8220;Let there be Light + [...]]]></description>
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			<div style="float:left; width:85px;padding-right:10px; margin:4px 4px 4px 4px;height:30px;"><script src="http://www.stumbleupon.com/hostedbadge.php?s=1&amp;r=http://www.diary.viveksanghi.com/2009/01/the-last-question-isaac-asimov/"></script></div>			
			</div><div style="clear:both"></div><div style="padding-bottom:4px;"></div><p>Hi,</p>
<p>Yesterday I wanted to read this amazing short story by Isaac Asimov that I had read long ago during my MBA course. I did not know the title of the story and only remembered that it ended with the following line: &#8220;Let there be light&#8221;. So I googled &#8220;Let there be Light + Isaac Asimov&#8221; and stumbled upon this <a href="http://www.multivax.com/last_question.html" target="_blank">site</a> (Recommend reading the story if you have time, otherwise try to follow the summary I have written below).</p>
<p><img title="Isaac Asimov - The Last Question" src="http://www.diary.viveksanghi.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/01/asimov-229x300.jpg" alt="Issac Asimov - The Last Question" width="229" height="300" align="right" /></p>
<p>The short story I am talking about is titled &#8220;The Last Question&#8221;. It was originally published in 1956 by Isaac Asimov. You can read more about this short story on its <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Last_Question" target="_blank">Wikipedia Page</a>.</p>
<p>The Last Question is undoubtedly the most fascinating short story and/or piece of science fiction that I have ever read. It addresses the ultimate question and what I believe gives the very meaning to our existence. While at the moment my mind is full of philosophy about human existence etc I will avoid going tangential.</p>
<p><strong>Summary of the Story</strong></p>
<p>Coming back to this story, it basically starts off with a question to which no one has an answer i.e.</p>
<blockquote><p>&#8220;Can entropy be reversed?&#8221;</p></blockquote>
<p>This question is posed to a super computer called Multivac which is the first true super computer with its own consciousness of sorts:</p>
<blockquote><p>&#8220;Multivac was self-adjusting and self-correcting. It had to be, for nothing human could adjust and correct it quickly enough or even adequately enough&#8221;</p></blockquote>
<p>On gaps of many millions of years this question is asked repeatedly by various people and they always get only one answer:</p>
<blockquote><p>&#8220;INSUFFICIENT DATA FOR MEANINGFUL ANSWER&#8221;</p></blockquote>
<p>Overtime the Multivac evolves into much more complex form and starts to exist in Hyperspace and across the cosmos connecting various galaxies in a manner which is best left to the whims of sci-fi authors. (I mean please read the story to get a sense; it&#8217;s very tough for me to explain this <img src='http://www.diary.viveksanghi.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> )</p>
<p>However even after all those evolutions; the main computer (called AC at the last stage of the story) is unable to find an answer to the question. For trillions of years the computer continues to collect data and try to solve this problem but is unable to do so. Read this short excerpt from the story:</p>
<blockquote><p>&#8220;Cosmic AC,&#8221; said Man, &#8220;How may entropy be reversed?&#8221;</p>
<p>The Cosmic AC said, &#8220;THERE IS AS YET INSUFFICIENT DATA FOR A MEANINGFUL ANSWER.&#8221;</p>
<p>Man said, &#8220;Collect additional data.&#8221;</p>
<p>The Cosmic AC said, &#8220;I WILL DO SO. I HAVE BEEN DOING SO FOR A HUNDRED BILLION YEARS. MY PREDECESSORS AND I HAVE BEEN ASKED THIS QUESTION MANY TIMES. ALL THE DATA I HAVE REMAINS INSUFFICIENT.&#8221;</p>
<p>&#8220;Will there come a time,&#8221; said Man, &#8220;when data will be sufficient or is the problem insoluble in all conceivable circumstances?&#8221;</p>
<p>The Cosmic AC said, &#8220;NO PROBLEM IS INSOLUBLE IN ALL CONCEIVABLE CIRCUMSTANCES.&#8221;</p>
<p>Man said, &#8220;When will you have enough data to answer the question?&#8221;</p>
<p>&#8220;THERE IS AS YET INSUFFICIENT DATA FOR A MEANINGFUL ANSWER.&#8221;</p>
<p>&#8220;Will you keep working on it?&#8221; asked Man.</p>
<p>The Cosmic AC said, &#8220;I WILL.&#8221;</p>
<p>Man said, &#8220;We shall wait.&#8221;</p></blockquote>
<p>Long after all humanity is gone due to exhaustion of all energy in the universe, the Cosmic AC continues to process data to find answer to this question. It finally finds an answer and then decides to demonstrate the solution as there was no human left to give the solution to.</p>
<p>It says &#8220;Let there be light&#8221;</p>
<p>According to Christianity, &#8220;Let there be light&#8221; are the words uttered by God after which Universe came into being (or let me say what I want to say: Big bang occurred and the natural processes unfolded and formed what we know and can see today)</p>
<p><strong>What intrigues me?</strong></p>
<p>Firstly any association of science and religion is something that I always find very interesting to read. And when it&#8217;s done by a master like Isaac Asimov, I have to write about it <img src='http://www.diary.viveksanghi.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>Secondly it is very intriguing to read about various sci-fi concepts that are discussed in this story. Let me explain these and my thoughts about it by quoting from the story.<strong> </strong></p>
<blockquote><p><strong>&#8220;Minds, not bodies! The immortal bodies remained back on the planets, in suspension over the eons.&#8221;</strong></p></blockquote>
<p>It instantly reminded me of two things:</p>
<p>1. <a title="Matrix's Wikipedia Page" href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Matrix" target="_blank">Matrix</a>: In this Hollywood blockbuster, most of the humans are plugged into the matrix and their bodies are actually immaterial. It is the prime program and the role of the mind in the simulated world that matters.</p>
<p>2.<a title="Bhagavad Gita's Wikipedia Page" href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bhagavad_Gita" target="_blank">Bhagavad Gita</a>: In Gita, Lord Krishna says that the loss of material bodies is not worthy of grief and one should not allow it to inhibit ones performance of duty. It is the soul that matters the most and the soul is eternal, indestructible and insoluble.</p>
<p>Well this is not to say that they borrowed from each other. I really don&#8217;t know about that. I am only trying to connect things in my mind.</p>
<blockquote><p><strong>&#8220;One by one Man fused with AC, each physical body losing its mental identity in a manner that was somehow not a loss but a gain.&#8221;</strong></p></blockquote>
<p>Again it obviously reminds me of Matrix where the human bodies are fused with a main computer that simulates the virtual world for the human minds while drawing power from their bodies &#8211;  An interesting &#8216;symbiotic relationship&#8217; which is certainly beneficial for both the parties. Machines get access to a virtually unlimited source of power while Humans are saved from their own self-destructive nature and get to survive as a race. As machines are a creation of humans they ensure (on behalf of humans) that the process of unraveling all the mysteries of universe goes on in a reasonable and unhindered manner while Humans (who are incapable carrying out the above mentioned process in an unhindered manner due to their self-destructive nature) continue to contribute to the same albeit in a tacit manner (assuming that the consciousness of the main computer is not derived from and/or is not the sum total of consciousness of all the human minds connected to it)</p>
<p>During the discourse of Bhagavat Gita to Arjuna on the battlefield of Kurukshetra , Lord Krishna displays his original form which Hindus normally refer to as the &#8216;<em>Virat Roop&#8217;.</em> In the Virat Roop, the lord shows that he is responsible for everything that we see around us. He is responsible for the life, death, calamity, success, happiness, grief etc. Two cool points arise out of this:</p>
<p>1. Matrix&#8217;s main computer does the same kind of simulation that god claims to do for us in his discourse in Bhagavad Gita.</p>
<p>2. In Isaac Asimov&#8217;s short story, there is not much clarity about how the main computer (referred to as the AC) utilizes the minds connected to it but what is certainly clear that humans consciously submit their minds to the AC and that the minds are living in a virtual/simulated world where they are capable of interacting with any other mind irrespective of the physical distances between them. In addition, the AC somehow derived its consciousness from the collective consciousness of the minds attached to it. Consider the excerpts (below) from the story based on which I have made the above-mentioned conclusions:</p>
<blockquote><p>&#8220;Man considered with himself, for in a way, Man, mentally, was one. He consisted of a trillion, trillion, trillion ageless bodies, each in its place, each resting quiet and incorruptible, each cared for by perfect automatons, equally incorruptible, while the minds of all the bodies freely melted one into the other, indistinguishable.&#8221;</p></blockquote>
<blockquote><p>&#8220;Zee Prime&#8217;s thoughts fled back to his own Galaxy. He gave no further thought to Dee Sub Wun, whose body might be waiting on a galaxy a trillion light-years away, or on the star next to Zee Prime&#8217;s own. It didn&#8217;t matter.&#8221;</p></blockquote>
<p>I might make additions to this post if I have any more thoughts and free time like I had today (I thought out and wrote the whole thing in office coz there is no other work <img src='http://www.diary.viveksanghi.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_razz.gif' alt=':P' class='wp-smiley' /> )</p>
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		<title>Celestial Questions</title>
		<link>http://www.diary.viveksanghi.com/2008/11/celestial-questions/</link>
		<comments>http://www.diary.viveksanghi.com/2008/11/celestial-questions/#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Sat, 22 Nov 2008 02:23:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Vivek</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Academics]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Diary]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[India]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Indian Mythology]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Mythology]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[ancient]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[mahabharata]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[wisdom]]></category>

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		<description><![CDATA[Tweet Note: Through this article I do not intend to endorse or promote any religion. This post is purely an effort to present some truly thought-provoking questions which should be read and reasoned upon, by all of us. After reading this post, you might ask why did I name this post &#8220;Celestial Questions&#8221;. This is [...]]]></description>
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			</div><div style="clear:both"></div><div style="padding-bottom:4px;"></div><p>Note: Through this article I do not intend to endorse or promote any religion. This post is purely an effort to present some truly thought-provoking questions which should be read and reasoned upon, by all of us.</p>
<p>After reading this post, you might ask why did I name this post &#8220;Celestial Questions&#8221;. This is because these questions were asked to Yudhistra (Son of Pandu and the true heir to the kindgom of Hastinapur) by the <em>Dharmaraj </em>(God of Truth) in the great India epic <a title="Author is not responsible for the content of external Sites" href="http://www.iloveindia.com/literature/sanskrit/indian-epics/mahabharata.html" target="_blank">Mahabharata</a>. (Recommend reading a summary of the story before proceeding)</p>
<p>During the final year (the <em>agyat-vaas</em>) of their exile, the Pandavas (i.e. five brothers and their wife Draupadi) were moving away swiftly from Hastinapur to avoid being discovered by the spies of Duryodhana (the villain of the story). If they were to be discovered, they would have to spend another 13 years in exile.</p>
<p>One day, after a bout of tiresome walking through the forest, the Pandavas stop to take some rest. They spot a lake nearby and Nakul (one of the brothers) is asked to fetch some water for everybody.<br />
When he reaches the lake and tries to drink the water, a demon (<em>yaksha</em>) warns him that if he drinks the water without answering some questions, he will face dire ramifications. Nakul ignores the warning and dies after drinking the water. His brothers Sahdev, Arjun and Bhim go to the lake one after the other and meet the same fate. However, when Yudhisthra arrives at the lake and sees his mighty brothers lying dead at the shore, he decides to remain calm and answer the demon&#8217;s questions. Here are the questions that the Demon asks:</p>
<p>1. What is heavier than Earth?<br />
Ans. Mother</p>
<p>2. What is higher than the Sky?<br />
Ans. Father</p>
<p>3. What is faster than the winds?<br />
Ans. The Mind</p>
<p>4. What is more in number than the twigs?<br />
Ans. Worry</p>
<p>5. Who is the friend of a person close to death?<br />
Ans. Charity</p>
<p>6. Where does Religion, Success, Heaven and Happiness reside?<br />
Ans. Religion resides in awareness, success in charity, Heaven in Truth and Happiness in Chastity</p>
<p>7. What is a man&#8217;s Soul?<br />
Ans. His Son</p>
<p>8. What has covered the Earth?<br />
Ans. Ignorance</p>
<p>9. What is laziness?<br />
Ans. Ignorance of religion is Laziness</p>
<p>10. Who is truly happy?<br />
Ans. One who is free of debt</p>
<p>11. What is true cleansing?<br />
Ans. The cleansing of the Mind</p>
<p>12. What is darker than the eye black?<br />
Ans. Disrepute</p>
<p>13. What is the best Religion?<br />
Ans. Compassion</p>
<p>14. What can prevent sadness and mourning?<br />
Ans. Control of Mind</p>
<p>15. What is shame?<br />
Ans. Keeping away from unworthy things</p>
<p>16. What is pity?<br />
Ans. Wishing happiness for all</p>
<p>17. What kills a nation?<br />
Ans. Slavery</p>
<p>18. What is the true test of Brahminhood? Dynasty, Character, Teaching or Knowledge?<br />
Ans. Character is the true test of Brahaminhood</p>
<p>19. Is Religion in Logic? Is it in the words of the Sages?<br />
Ans. Religion is neither in logic nor in the words of the sages. Truth of a Religion is in the heart of the believer.</p>
<p>20. What is the greatest wonder?<br />
Ans. The greatest wonder is that each individual knows that death is the ultimate truth yet he/she believes that his/her life&#8217;s ultimate truth may not be death.</p>
<p>Satisfied by Yudhistra&#8217;s responses, the demon reveals his true identity as <em>Dharmaraj</em> (the God of Truth) and says that by his conduct and character, Yudhistra had not just established control over his mind and body but also conquered the virtues of tolerance and the imperfections i.e. hunger, thirst, mourning, temptation and death.</p>
<p>I will not elucidate my thoughts regarding the above-mentioned questions and leave the forum open for reader discussions.</p>
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